1 2013-05-28T00:04:39 <SunuTheNinja> Congrats everybody :-)
2 2013-05-28T00:04:56 <SunuTheNinja> I missed the dying moments of melange :'(
3 2013-05-28T03:20:42 *** chitrank
4 2013-05-28T05:44:54 *** chitrank
5 2013-05-28T06:52:10 *** sunumonster
6 2013-05-28T06:52:27 *** sunumonster
7 2013-05-28T07:57:13 *** chitrank
8 2013-05-28T08:18:41 <ThomasWaldmann> moin
9 2013-05-28T09:52:13 *** dennda_
10 2013-05-28T09:54:00 *** dennda_
11 2013-05-28T09:57:12 *** greg_f
12 2013-05-28T10:05:50 <ThomasWaldmann> xiaq: sharky93: https://moinmo.in/GoogleSoc2013 please add yourself there
13 2013-05-28T11:25:47 *** sharky93|Android
14 2013-05-28T11:26:27 <sharky93|Android> moin
15 2013-05-28T12:13:53 <ThomasWaldmann> hi sharky93|Android
16 2013-05-28T12:32:53 * sharky93|Android just found out that he and sunu live 500kms apart :)
17 2013-05-28T12:57:17 *** dave_largo
18 2013-05-28T13:46:12 <ThomasAH> Hi! I wrote an auth plugin for moin, it works well and users can be assigned to groups without creating corresponding FooGroup pages. Problem is:
19 2013-05-28T13:46:58 <ThomasAH> When I restart Moin the group information is lost, though the login information is not. Can I keep this permanent?
20 2013-05-28T13:47:18 <ThomasAH> (worst case: using Moin as CGI, then it is immediately lost)
21 2013-05-28T13:50:08 <ronny> ThomasAH: so you dont persist it?
22 2013-05-28T13:51:05 <ThomasAH> ronny: what is "it" in your question?
23 2013-05-28T13:52:12 <ronny> ThomasAH: the information about the groups a user has
24 2013-05-28T13:52:42 <ThomasAH> ronny: yes, how can I do it? If I store it in the session, can the user manipulate it or where it this stored?
25 2013-05-28T13:52:50 <ThomasAH> where is this ...
26 2013-05-28T13:53:06 <ronny> ThomasAH: sessions are NOT persistent
27 2013-05-28T13:53:31 <ronny> ThomasAH: as far as i can tell, just a logout/relogin could end it
28 2013-05-28T13:54:18 <ronny> ThomasAH: moin did use the FooGroup pages to persist such data
29 2013-05-28T13:55:00 <ronny> you cant just put it into the user page, since users shouldnt be able to edit what groups they are in
30 2013-05-28T13:55:08 <ThomasAH> ronny: logout+relogin is no problem ... my problem is: login (detects groups), restart Moin, login stays available but group information is lost
31 2013-05-28T13:55:24 <ronny> ThomasAH: where do you put the group data you create?
32 2013-05-28T13:55:54 <ThomasAH> ronny: a SAML-like ticket for single sign on is provided by a trusted server
33 2013-05-28T13:56:35 <ronny> ThomasAH: i only want to know where you put the data about the groups a user gets
34 2013-05-28T13:56:37 <ronny> nothing else
35 2013-05-28T13:58:11 <ThomasAH> ronny: currently a dictionary, which is an attribute of an instance of a class based on BaseAuth
36 2013-05-28T14:00:26 <ronny> ThomasAH: then your plugin is by definition not working
37 2013-05-28T14:00:59 <ronny> ThomasAH: btw, why do you want to avoid the FooGroup pages (thats whats used for persisting that data)
38 2013-05-28T14:01:25 <ThomasAH> ronny: I know that it is not working yet :) That's why I ask how I could do this
39 2013-05-28T14:02:14 <ronny> ThomasAH: well - usually things are persisted in something like duh, pages
40 2013-05-28T14:02:34 <ronny> which is why you have the FooGroup pages
41 2013-05-28T14:02:44 <ronny> thats where it gets persisted
42 2013-05-28T14:02:49 <ronny> so why do you want to avoid those?
43 2013-05-28T14:03:17 <ronny> what problem do you have with just having FooGroup pages?
44 2013-05-28T14:03:43 <ThomasAH> ronny: I saw the other ways of associating a user to a group in MoinMoin/datastruct/backends and thought it was a great idea :)
45 2013-05-28T14:04:30 <ThomasAH> ronny: how would I maintain them automatically? (primary source for the group mapping is the ticket server)
46 2013-05-28T14:05:07 <ronny> ThomasAH: well, you could always load it fro mthe ticketserver if thats the primary source anyway
47 2013-05-28T14:05:27 <ronny> and you better load it dynamically
48 2013-05-28T14:05:40 <ronny> cause else as soon as you have moin in 2 processes, you are going to have a bad time
49 2013-05-28T14:06:11 <ThomasAH> ronny: the ticket server gives me a ticket only once, which is a signed XML with basically username, expiry date and groups ...
50 2013-05-28T14:06:24 <ThomasAH> ronny: I can't ask the ticketserver again afterwards
51 2013-05-28T14:07:40 <ThomasAH> how is the username remembered in the session?
52 2013-05-28T14:09:01 <ronny> its just stored there
53 2013-05-28T14:09:29 <ronny> hmm, i should read the code again for more details
54 2013-05-28T14:09:30 <ThomasAH> where is "there" and can I add my own information?
55 2013-05-28T14:10:38 <ronny> ThomasAH: im under the impression you didnt tell all details about what you wana do and we are suffering from the XY problem
56 2013-05-28T14:12:51 <ThomasAH> ronny: I would like to show you the code, I'm currently waiting for the permission from the customer to publish it, which I do not expect to be a problem, but I have to wait anyway
57 2013-05-28T14:14:14 <ThomasAH> I just looked at the session handling ... the cookie just has a hash and the real data is stored below wiki/data/cache/__session__/ ... I think I can make it work with that
58 2013-05-28T14:14:17 <ThomasWaldmann> hi ThomasAH
59 2013-05-28T14:14:22 <ThomasAH> ThomasWaldmann: hi!
60 2013-05-28T14:18:30 <ThomasWaldmann> it sounds a bit like that saml ticket groups thing is different from what we need
61 2013-05-28T14:19:25 <ThomasAH> ThomasWaldmann: besides from the persistence it already works, and the persistence will work when I store the groups I get from the ticket in the session
62 2013-05-28T14:19:28 <ThomasWaldmann> it's telling user u is in groups X,Y,Z. but the moin groups backend might rather need to know that for all users and all groups, not only for the ones who are currently logged in.
63 2013-05-28T14:19:59 <ThomasWaldmann> e.g. if moin is sending notifies to users about acl protected page changes
64 2013-05-28T14:21:12 <ThomasAH> ThomasWaldmann: That feature will obviously not work, yes, but this is not important for this setup
65 2013-05-28T14:21:48 <ThomasAH> ThomasWaldmann: and as long as nobody restarts the server it will work for the people recently having logged in :)
66 2013-05-28T14:26:13 <ThomasWaldmann> well, for specific acls this might escalate your priviledges maybe
67 2013-05-28T14:26:52 <ThomasWaldmann> e.g. #acl -SomeGroup:read All:read
68 2013-05-28T14:32:06 <ThomasAH> ThomasWaldmann: but the user who edits the page is logged in, so this is not a problem
69 2013-05-28T14:33:01 <ThomasAH> ah, All:read ... I would not consider this secure anyway :)
70 2013-05-28T14:39:15 *** sharky93|Android
71 2013-05-28T14:40:23 <ThomasWaldmann> ThomasAH: the point is that the SomeGroup check should work correctly or the acl will be evaluated wrong
72 2013-05-28T14:40:25 *** sharky93|Android
73 2013-05-28T14:42:29 <ThomasAH> ThomasWaldmann: sure, internally I create a dict of groups with lists of users. It will not be complete, except for the currently active user. So except for notifications it should be fine
74 2013-05-28T14:45:05 *** chitrank
75 2013-05-28T14:49:38 <ThomasAH> http://moinmo.in/action/login/HelpOnSessions ... can somebody replace "is_new" with "new"? The code in 1.9 says: Deprecated use of MoinSession.is_new, please use .new
76 2013-05-28T14:50:05 <ThomasAH> uhm, http://moinmo.in/HelpOnSessions ... how did /action/login get in there?
77 2013-05-28T15:05:17 <ThomasAH> it works :)
78 2013-05-28T15:06:15 <ThomasAH> have to leave now ... I will publish the plugin soon, so you can take a closer look ... maybe something that can be included in Moin itself as an example
79 2013-05-28T15:09:12 <ThomasWaldmann> put it on codereview.appspot.com, preferably
80 2013-05-28T15:54:42 *** sharky93|Android
81 2013-05-28T16:19:37 *** sharky93|Android
82 2013-05-28T16:33:51 *** sharky93||Androi
83 2013-05-28T16:33:52 *** sharky93|Android
84 2013-05-28T16:37:03 *** sharky93||Androi
85 2013-05-28T16:37:21 *** sharky93|Android
86 2013-05-28T17:48:20 *** chitrank
87 2013-05-28T17:48:42 *** chitrank
88 2013-05-28T17:50:50 *** greg_f
89 2013-05-28T18:05:46 *** sharky93||Androi
90 2013-05-28T18:05:47 *** sharky93|Android
91 2013-05-28T18:18:41 *** ronny
92 2013-05-28T18:21:59 *** sharky93|Android
93 2013-05-28T18:22:06 *** sharky93||Androi
94 2013-05-28T18:27:46 *** ronny
95 2013-05-28T18:34:11 *** sharky93
96 2013-05-28T18:35:13 *** chitrank
97 2013-05-28T18:36:41 *** sharky93
98 2013-05-28T18:38:53 *** H0arry
99 2013-05-28T18:39:41 *** chitrank
100 2013-05-28T18:57:05 *** chitrank
101 2013-05-28T19:13:05 <ThomasWaldmann> re
102 2013-05-28T19:24:42 <ThomasWaldmann> xiaq: TheSheep: https://moinmo.in/GoogleSoc2013 please subscribe to the page
103 2013-05-28T19:42:21 *** [BNC]sharky93
104 2013-05-28T20:06:00 *** [BNC]sharky93
105 2013-05-28T21:08:34 *** dave_largo
106 2013-05-28T21:59:34 *** brunomartin
107
